Discipline

Becki · Discipline

I am having a terrible time with my middle daughter aged 6. She is driving me to despair and I'm ashamed to say, I'm losing my temper.
Last night she was really rude to me, back chatting and generally being horrible. She lied about breaking her brand new swimming goggles and is ignoring any kind of punisment (like stopping treats etc) Her punishments are usually, not coming somewhere with me, stopping riding, things like that.

I was wondering if anyone has any other ideas because I'm starting to wonder whether we both need to get some professional help.

Bovey Belle

I think she's had a huge upheaval with the move Becki, which is probably influencing her a lot. Rather than having a head-to-head with her, perhaps try to side-step and come from a different angle on this? Negatives x several don't always = positive. Perhaps you could sit down with her and see if she is missing her old friends, having problems at her new school - something along those lines? Perhaps you could make sure you do something together, just you and her? I have a feeling it is something like that which is causing her rudeness to you. Big ((((HUGS)))) to you both.

Kathy

At age 6 children go through some major changes, I think I remember you saying the tooth fairy had visited and that's part of the change. It's a difficult time for them, a bit like puberty really.
E has had some spectacular tantrums lately, and also with the back chatting.
Everyone has different ways of dealing with it, we don't enter into a dialogue at all with her, just totally ignore any "shenanigans".
Like you, I've also found that the treat deprivation punishments just don't work, it creates a cycle which escalates the situation, if you know what I mean.
When she is quiet again after a tantrum, back chatting session, that's when we'll have a chat with her and ask how she is feeling and why she feels she needs to behave in such a way. Sometimes things come out like little worries that mean seem trivial to us but are a major thing to them. Sometimes she'll just say, "well I felt "crabbit" and cross. I think the important thing is not to react, that's what they are looking for and by ignoring them that is punishment enough.

Not sure if any of this will be a help to you Becki but most children do go through this phase and I'm sure there'll be a few forum members who have other "coping strategies". Smile

Kathy

Oh yes, of course, she's had the whole moving thing too, a stressful time for the whole family. She's got a great Mum, Becki try not to worry too much.

Libby

We used to have horrendous problems with Tori and it was really hard work but I had to stay on top of it. Stupid little things I totally ignored, obviously praising anything good no matter how little!
Lieing I would not tolerate in any way shape or form, I would make her sit on the stairs, where I could see her but she had nothing to do but think about what she had said for about 5 mins and then go back and talk very quitely to her.
Instant punishments work far better than, not going riding on Saturday, that just drags things out and causes resentment! No computer or Tv that night or for a hour or missing her favourite programme you know your daughter best.
An excellent way of giving her personal time is reading a bedtime story, we read to both our girls in their own rooms until they where into their teens!! They still talk about it now!! Obviously reading older books to them!

Stay calm, you love her to pieces really, just tell her how special she is to you!

xx

Leonie2

I've had the back chatting thing with S too. Keep with it and remember all the changes from the move will be a big thing for a 6 year old. S gets very unsettled when things change and he shows it by being what appears to be deliberately difficult and naughty. It does pass but be firm and consistent with what you expect from them. Every year in Sept I have a problem with S, the change of year group to new teacher unsettles him enough to cause problems. I also think when things change it's a natural thing for children to push the boundaries to see what they can and can't do, keep the boundaries consistent and you'll probably find after a few weeks things will get back to normal. Remember not to lose your temper, if you feel you're heading that way try to give yourself some time out too, just to cool off, otherwise it will only make things worse.

I find sometimes the withdrawing of privelages doesn't work but offering a reward for good behaviour or trying hard does work. Have you tried a reward chart? I used to dismiss it but I've recently started one and it's working a treat. I have a few things on the chart, mostly quite easy to achieve things but I throw in a difficult one just to challenge things a bit. The easy things give them the confidence boost and the difficult one gets them trying that bit harder to achieve what I want. At the end of the week they get the reward so they're happy and during the week I see they're trying hard which makes me happy, so we're all happy. And I've also found that they generally try harder in everything, not just the things on their chart.

alison

What about time out for 5 mins, then a quick sorry, and forget about it.

If she then won't participate in this appology take off a star on the 2nd part - a good girl star chart, with a special treat at the end.

Proberbly she is a bit fed up too of being to young for things, or not having a space at rainbows.

kaz

My advice would be the same as the others - I enjoy watching Supernanny - she is never 'training' the kids, just showing the parent how to cope with the children Very Happy

Lots of praise for positives and ingnore the minor negatives while you can.
Good Luck.

lloyd

Kids can also be like pets, in picking up on vibes and moods in the home. If they are unhappy with a given set of circumstances, even say, Mark being away all week, then they might not vocalise that but express it with alternate means of communication instead, such as reactionary behaviour.

Becki

Lloydie, they throw a party Monday mornings.

Joking aside, she emptied her piggy bank earlier and gave me all of the money to by new goggles that she had sat and broke. She is begging me to let her go riding. I hate taking that away from her, because it is E that gets to do all the activites.
The money amounted to 11p. Bless her. She has said she is really sorry and she did try very hard to behave tonight.

We have some bonding issues aswell, going back to when I had post natal depression and I can still feel it now, not the depression, the bonding bit. I am trying very hard.

lloyd

That last bit is really touching. 11p. All she has in the world.

Does she perceive money to be an issue maybe?

Hmm.............Talk to CP about post natal depression, Becksta! Wink

Think she may still have it 21 years later!! Laughing

Bovey Belle

Well Becki - I would take her 11p and say that will go towards the new goggles. She obviously feels that she can't "unbreak" them and that is her way of saying sorry and offering the olive branch. Being a "softee mummy" as my kids always call me, I would meet her halfway and accept her offer and reinstate the riding. But as I said, I'm a softee mummy . . .

Becki

I havn't told her yet she can go riding, but i will let her. She keeps asking if she can still go and I've said 'we'll see how you behave' she has accepted this without the normal stamping of feet and her high pitched scream. I need to calm down I think and stop getting worked up about it too.

Kathy, when you say you ignore the tantrums, do you not say anything at all to her about the behaviour and not speak until she has stopped?

Kathy

Yes Becki, we leave whatever room the tantrum is taking place in. All that happens when you try and "deal with it" is everyone just start shouting louder, and the child can't listen anyway. Only when all the angst has escaped can the child actually hear and perhaps verbalise how they feel.

Becki

Do you say anything at all? Like I'll talk to you when you calm down etc?

I'm going to try harder to do this, I do try anyway but I always end up shouting Embarassed

Bovey Belle

Leaving the room was one thing that worked with Gabby - if they realize they don't have an audience, they feel a bit silly yelling to themselves! Just go quietly and go and make a cup of tea or something.

willow

Maybe you should try not letting her go riding, once they realize that you mean what you say and a punishment will be followd through, the next time the behaviour is unacceptable you may find you only have to threaten to take away her riding or other activities she enjoys for a week and her behaviour might improve. I went through a similar thing with my middle son who is now 10 when he was 8, i used to say right thats it you're not going to football or swimming this week, but i always gave in when the day arrived, and it didn't take long for him to cotton on to the fact that i never followed a punishment through, so he would play up as much as he liked because he knew i wouldn't actually do anything about it. Once i did follow it through his behaviour changed almost overnight because he knew that i wasn't the push over i had been before.

Leonie2

I agree with willow. It's really hard to do. The school rules are no riding scooters in the school grounds. Every day I had a problem with J insisting on riding her scooter and a battle of wills. The school run with scooters was stressful because she would not listen to me at all, not just the riding in school grounds but racing off ahead along a fairly busy road with me shouting at her in the distance to come back which she ignored. One day I said that I'd take her scooter away if she did it again, which she did. I carried her scooter home not allowing her to ride it, she screamed and had a strop all the way home. I felt like all the mums were looking at me thinking what a horrid mum I was being but I really had to get the message through to J. That was a couple of months ago and she's never ridden her scooter in school grounds again or raced off ahead of me. In fact she's the little "policeman" now telling everyone else off if they do it.

Remember to be consistent, and I really do recommend carrying threats through. If you can't carry a threat through then don't make it in the first place otherwise they quickly learn that when you threaten punishment it means nothing.

Kathy

Becki

I have stopped riding before. She didn't go for 3 weeks in a row before. She knows I'll do it, but it makes no difference. I havn't actually said she can go yet, and she has been better. I'm going to give the completely ignoring her option a go and see how that does Smile

alison

Won't matter this week, so you can tell her she can't go. The stables is closed, because they are down at the Devon show everyday, taking horses for the farrier exibit. Found out this morning, but haven't seen you yet, to tell you! I know that is a bit mean, but she will still get the message.

Becki

Well last night E did something silly, so I quietly said that neither of them is goind riding this week and that we are going to use the time to talk about the move, school, firends etc. M said she was really very sorry and E said sorry too. I said that I knew they were but they still wern't going riding. No tantrum. Had a little one this morning but I waited until she had stopped and said good i can talk to you now. I feel abit guilty about the riding thing with it not being on Laughing

Leonie2

it looks like things are getting a little better already becki, keep at it, it will pay off for you. remember to reward them or thank and encourage them for when they're being good Very Happy

alison

Aqui

reading this thread with great interest...

it's so sweet that she offered her 11p. i've always thought that punishments should somehow be making up for what has been done wrong - although obviously i don't know if this is going to work! i know i'm going to be softee mum!

sounds like things are really improving, though, becki - keep up the good work!

Becki

E dosn't know that it isn't on. I was going to tell her and then she did this incredibly silly thing and I've used it as her punishment aswell.

Cabbagepatch

Becki, I can't really add anything to the useful suggestions already mentioned. All I know is that being a parent can be incredibly difficult and painful, it's not like fixing a plug or something.

No one gets it perfectly right and I bet we can all admit to getting it very wrong sometimes.

OK, I'll go first.....

I lost my temper one day when whatever I offered the little ones to eat they complained about. Eventually they wanted cheese on toast with ketchup. Then refused to eat it. Out of sheer frustration and exhaustion (single parenthood has a lot to answer for sometimes), I hurled a plate across the kitchen. A tile behind the sink still has a piece missing from it. Ahem, one or two other dents around the house as well Embarassed

Sorry, I'm just a mere mortal with many many flaws.

OK, who's next?

Kathy

I threw a slipper across the room in frustration (3 girls squabbling), Greenman chose the wrong moment to walk into the room and got it right in the eye. Got a photo of his black eye somewhere!

nanny

i lost my temper with my 19 yr old 6 ft son once in the kitchen and had him up against the kitchen cabinets on tip toe with my hand round his throat

mr nanny stood in the back door and his mouth dropped open let me tell you as he had never seen me in such a temper like that before (or since)

19 yr old son moved out not long after i think........

so there was a good result really..............

kaz

nanny

Becki

I've got to the bottom of the latest tantrums, she is in the middle of having a set to with another girl at school. I think she has been honest about it and I think it's 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. The other little girl seems as upset as M, she says to M 'shut up' and follows her round all the time and M says 'I hate you' and both of them have been crying and not wanting to go to school. The teacher I spoke to at school today is going to get them both together on Monday, and try to talk to them.

alison

Thinking who it is, I wonder if Je is threatened by you living next door to her perticular friends, and thinks the M will take over her position.

Maybe you should invite her, her mum and brother round for coffee, and get to know them. They are a very nice family, so I would think it was worth a try. The dad is the dogs vet!

Kathy

I'm pleased you've got to the bottom of it Becki. Smile

kaz

They take it all so seriously at that age Shocked

Bovey Belle

What a relief that you have found out what was causing the bad behaviour. It's not easy having to establish yourself afresh in a new school where friendships are already formed. I'm glad that you and the teacher will be able to sort it out now. I hope she enjoys her riding next week - has she got a favourite pony yet?

Becki

she has only ridden the same one at the moment. They have all been really good since the talk. Fingers crossed Very Happy

nanny